Noisy neighbours!
Frustrated posted on the 27/03/2014 12:44:44 PM
Hi all, just after some advice on how to tackle a problem.
I moved into my flat about a year ago and there was a lovely young couple upstairs with a baby who I could often hear moving around (to be expected in a flat) but never caused any noise issues. Around September of last year the noise of them moving around got a lot worse - constant thumping from walking back and forth ALL day and night, furniture being dragged, sounded like DIY work...put it down to redecorating  - although it was annoying when we heard furniture being dragged from room to room in the early hours of the morning...
Come November things took a funny turn, and I spent many nights hearing their 'nocturnal activities' (which I had never heard before) above me in the main bedroom - this was when I came to the conclusion that this was not the same couple that had originally lived there...This wasn't just a few quiet noises...this was bed hammering against the wall, screaming, shouting (ALL the details!) to the point where I would be woken up at 2/3am with my doors and shelves rattling from it. It became a regular occurence that I'd be woken up in the early hours and they would continue for 3-4 hours...
I ended up posting a polite note up to them (didn't fancy confronting them about such a personal topic) and asked them to be aware of noise levels after 11pm during the week as I have uni/exams/work etc. Had to send a further (more firm) note a few weeks after when things had got no better.
Now, the 'nocturnal activities' are quieter (but seem to move from room to room now!) but they are CONSTANTLY walking around, thumping, dropping things, dragging things from around 7am-midnight/1am every night. I have to sleep with earplugs just so I'm not woken up. Because it's only really 'walking around' that is causing the noises I don't feel like I can complain to them again.
It's a bizarre situation - some people have even suggested there is some sort of brothel or drug deal going on up there! Something's not right, but I don't feel confident confronting them (I'm a young female student!)
Any general advice for noisy neighbours..?
- 29 Replies :
#1 - Craig replied on the 27/03/2014 1:56:25 PM
Contact the council and they will take strong action against this. Google: glasgow city council noise abatement team
Noise after 11 or 12 is not tolerated and the council will send a member to monitor sound level, if it breaks their set limit they will serve them with a notice. If the noise continues strong action is taken.
This is the only way to stop the situation.
I probably live in the same style flat as you and I hear people walking around above me and sometimes furniture dragging which is super annoying but it's only every so often. If it was every night until 1am i'd be pulling my hair out with frustration.
But I wouldn't feel nervous to confront the situation. No one should have to put up with it.
#2 - anon_l replied on the 27/03/2014 1:58:18 PM
Get on to the council - they have a department for environmental noise. Even though most of it is normal every day activities, it needs to be done at an acceptable level of noise. Do you know if they rent at all? Who their landlords are - maybe get in touch with them.
I've had noisy neighbours in the past and its not good but found the council to be very helpful.
#3 - The Mentalist replied on the 27/03/2014 2:45:23 PM
Just a polite visit to their door asking them to keep it down. If you get cheek, call the community police.
#4 - DW replied on the 27/03/2014 3:24:07 PM
I have contacted Glasgow Community safety services in the past due to  problem neighbours they were really helpful. They might ask you if there are any of your other neighbours that at being disturbed by the noise so might be worth while approaching your other neighbours if you feel comfortable doing this . Phoning the police on 101 is another option.  Good luck
#5 - craig replied on the 27/03/2014 4:34:49 PM
I would also suggest recording the noise somehow. Maybe use your phone. You can use this as evidence to show the council. will encourage them to act more speedily.
#6 - Frustrated replied on the 27/03/2014 4:35:53 PM
Thanks all! Wasn't aware of the council department so I'll look into that. I'm just concerned that it won't be seen as being that noisy to someone who doesn't have to put up with it all the time. I mean it does rattle my doors etc but sometimes they're out or it doesn't seem as bad as other nights.
I'm assuming they rent. I had to go up there to collect a parcel one day and the decor in the hallway was the same as it had been with the young couple that lived their when I first moved in...I did a bit of searching online and found the property and the rent-per-month cost...I tried to see if I could find a name for the owner but I guess that's not published.
I've been writing stuff down the last month on a nightly basis and have tried to record the thumping on my phone when it's really bad but the mic doesn't really pick it up.
#7 - Malarki replied on the 27/03/2014 6:03:17 PM
Landlords have responsibility for ensuring their tenants are not a nuisance to neighbours under the Antisocial Behaviour etc. (Scotland) Act 2004 which also requires them to register if renting out their property exactly so you can contact them if there are problems. If the landlord is registered their details should be here: www.landlordregistrationscotland.gov.uk/Pages/Process.aspx?Command=ShowHomePage&Reset=true
If they are not registered, they are committing an offence and you can contact the council to report it: www.glasgow.gov.uk/index.aspx?articleid=7460
#8 - Dennistonian replied on the 27/03/2014 6:07:49 PM
Do you have a factor? Â If so contact them. Â I had problems with noisy neighbours and that's exactly what I did.
Weirdly enough I live across from a flat that had a young couple and baby but they moved recently and I'm not sure who moved in but they've had quite a few parties but now it's gone quiet. Â If it continues i'll be complaining to my factor.
#9 - Frustrated replied on the 27/03/2014 6:57:01 PM
Thank you both! About to look at the landlord registration page...
I do have a factor - my Dad has the details (he owns and is the landlord of my flat) so I'll ask him if needs be.
Coincidence! They seem to have 'get togethers' every so often as well, but not too often.
#10 - Frustrated replied on the 27/03/2014 6:58:29 PM
Malarki: Just looked at the website - no one is registered...if they owned the property would there still be a name listed there or is it only specifically for landlords renting out a flat?
#11 - Malarki replied on the 27/03/2014 10:08:59 PM
The register is only for landlords (not tenants or agents) renting out their property. If they are not on the register (or in the process of registering) then they are in breach of the legislation. Owner occupiers are not required to register as they are not landlords.
#12 - Concerned replied on the 29/03/2014 11:03:22 AM
If you think it's a brothel, you're probably right. Seem to be a few "under the radar" ones popping up in Alexandra Parade. Not going to name any of them, but they are certainly there. All of them in peoples flats. Police know about a few of them (because I've told them).
#13 - Frustrated replied on the 29/03/2014 6:02:10 PM
Concerned - how were you aware of these enough to be able to report them to the police? The thought cross my mind one night when the noise was bad to phone 101 and report it, along with my suspicions, but I don't feel like making an assumption that could possibly be (and probably is) wrong...I'm not sure how common they are but something doesn't add up and I am aware that they very rarely leave the flat like most people would do to go to work etc...every day they are in all day - it's very rarely that they seeem to be out (when the thumping stops!)
#14 - anon replied on the 29/03/2014 8:30:35 PM
If it was a brothel surely you'd be aware of people coming and going in the close as well---and I wonder too about the noise being in the middle of the night. I don't know much about brothels but I would have thought that if you were running something illegal you'd be trying hard not to draw the neighbours attention towards yourself. It does sound very strange though.
#15 - Concerned replied on the 30/03/2014 10:56:32 AM
Not that I'm an expert in brothels, but normally they aren't very busy. You wouldn't get constant people going up and down your flats like you'd get if somebody was a drug dealer. In my experience, I noticed a lot of expensive cars being parked outside my flat (we weren't used to that) and fairly well dressed men going up. Normally after 5pm.
#16 - Frustrated replied on the 31/03/2014 4:05:54 PM
I'm not very aware of people entering or leaving the building, but simply because it's a very modern block of flats and i'm on the second floor, well away from the stairs and wouldn't hear anything. I am aware occasionally there are "get togethers" (not as noisy as parties) and can hear a lot of voices chatting in the room above me (main bedroom).
I don't know if it is a brothel but something doesn't add up. They constantly seem to be moving furniture, are always hoovering very late at night and always seem to have the washing machine going (probably not that weird but it just seems odd that they're always cleaning!)
It goes through periods of being loud days and quieter days..it's been quiet for the past couple (still lots of thumping when they're walkign around though)
#17 - jake replied on the 1/04/2014 8:52:01 AM
i had a problem couple of years ago,was told to get in touch with Glasgow antisociai, phone number 01412767409/01412876688.They came out to our flat recorded the noise and sorted with in a week,the person in charge at the time was Michael Lavelle.Good luck
#18 - Shirley Knot replied on the 1/04/2014 9:43:49 AM
Do your upstairs neighbours have stripped floorboards?
#19 - Frustrated replied on the 3/04/2014 5:41:27 PM
It sounds like they do but I can't be sure...their hallway definitely doesn't...
I've been sitting in my living room working on an essay all afternoon and they've been constantly walking around and thumping upstairs...I don't know what they're doing but it's just huge thumps making everything rattle every time they take a step...
I feel a bit awkward about complaining during the day as I guess people can do what they want during the day...but I don't think I should have to deal with everything in my flat shaking all the time...I mean, I can't concentrate or get any work done...
#20 - Malarki replied on the 3/04/2014 7:12:56 PM
If I remember my housing law right, you have right to "quiet enjoyment" of the property. This is what you should be getting the council/police to help assert.
#21 - Shirley Knot replied on the 4/04/2014 7:34:52 PM
By all means go ahead and lodge a complain with the council however it doesn't sound as if your experience is vastly different to mine and I'm in a tenement flat below a rented apartment with stripped floorboards.
There is no inherent soundproofing in these tenements I believe, so with stripped floorboards, you have the above flat's floorboards, the joists, and then then your plasterboard, with nothing in between to muffle the sound.
The past few years have been a cacophony of children running around in outdoor shoes, dragging furniture at all hours of the day and night, VACUUMING the floorboards, thundering around in high heels through the day and night, objects being dropped and rolling about. Â The noise is indescribable and my health has been impacted. Â I hear everything, and I mean, EVERYTHING, from their flat.
The landlords are totally disinterested and say it's just "modern living". The council's attitude is that the neighbours are merely engaging in "normal household activities" and they will not take any action over "impact noise" such as what you seem to be describing.
I believe that stripped floorboards, and to a lesser extent laminate and wooden floors, are totally inappropriate for flats above ground level, particularly in flats with no inherent soundproofing.
#22 - Frustrated replied on the 5/04/2014 9:57:50 PM
Shirley Knot - sounds exactly the same to me, and that's the exact words the council told me when I contacted them a few days ago...even though a lot of the noise is in day/evening, I still assumed something would be able to be done...it's so frustrating and I get to the point where I just want to follow their route of stomping with a broom hammering on the ceiling wherever they go!
#23 - Malarki replied on the 6/04/2014 11:23:34 AM
I'm not convinced that nothing can be done or that the council have given an appropriate response. Â I have lived in properties where the conditions in the deeds have stated that those living above the ground floor should not have stripped floors such that noise is reduced. It may well be that the deeds of the properties do provide some such clauses which require the owner to maintain the property in such a way so as to avoid nuisance to neighbours. When it comes to tenented properties it would seem reasonable to require landlords to carpet and underlay floors to provide a greater level of sound insulation.
I'd suggest contacting Shelter for independent advice (scotland.shelter.org.uk/get_advice) or you could also try one of the GAIN agencies (www.gain4u.org.uk/ - I'd think this might be one for a law centre rather than CAB but often they work together and can refer more complex cases onwards).
Also, as far as I know, tenement properties were built with insulation between floors - they used ash which is why it can get very messy if your ceiling comes down and it's original. If floors/ceiling have been replaced then the ash may not have and so then sound insulation will not be as good anymore. Until last summer we had a family with 3 children under the age of 8 living above us - we very rarely heard anything from them.
#24 - Concerned replied on the 6/04/2014 11:24:41 AM
I wouldn't start taking a broom to the roof. Seems to **** off a lot of people these days. Not something you could do in this day and age. Years ago you could, not now. Just asking for trouble. Best go up to them and have a word.
#25 - Shirley Knot replied on the 6/04/2014 8:13:56 PM
Malarki, did the family living above you have open floorboards? Â If not, then the comparison does not hold. Â Until you have lived in a tenement property below upstairs neighbours with that sort of flooring, you really can't imagine the level of noise even "everyday living" produces. Â Yes, you may be lucky to get the odd quiet soul who pads around in their stockings and is cognisant of the type of flooring they're living on. Â But from my experience of living under five sets of tenants on stripped floors, this is not the norm.
I can't speak for anyone else's title deeds but mine say nothing about the requirement for adequately covered flooring. Â Probably because the tenements were built in the 19th century, at a time where the trend was to carpet, and only the very poor left the floors in their original state. Â Whatever rudimentary provision was made for soundproofing in those days (ash, etc), the efficacy has long worn out.
It may also seem "reasonable" to expect landlords/owners to adequately soundproof their apartments, but the law currently does not appear to support this. Â The council flatly state that impact noise produced from open floorboards in an upper flat is not something they would consider as a noise nuisance, although they "recommend" carpeting in upper flats.
Whilst this would not tackle the issue of owner occupies, I feel strongly that potential landlords should not be allowed to register with LRS or the local authority until their property has been appropriately floored. Â The councils KNOW this type of flooring is profoundly anti- social and injurious to the health and well being of those in surrounding flats, yet they continue to bury their heads in the sand.
#26 - The Mentalist replied on the 7/04/2014 1:04:17 PM
What happened to people just living normally? Â They now live with heards of elephant, cycle around their flats on scooters, play 11 a sides footie and all at 2 am. Â At least, that's what it feels like...
#27 - Malarki replied on the 9/04/2014 8:54:01 AM
Shirley - that was my point. My ex-upstairs neighbours (in a tenement) mostly didn't have bare floorboards/laminate (the latter being the devil's work) and as a result we didn't have much noise. But it doesn't help if the insulation which was built into the construction of the tenements (the traditional ash I referred to) has also been removed.
As regards what the council says - that doesn't mean it's right. I work in a job where I spend my day helping people deal with problems caused by the fact that councils and government departments don't get it right. Constantly. Problem is people take their word for it and as a result lose out on what they're entitled to and get into hardship. Because people think that officials can't be wrong they don't challenge their decisions or advice, when in fact they should be questioning what they say routinely. Â That's why I suggested getting some independent advice from a third party in such cases, ie Shelter, a CAB or a law centre - I'm not a housing specialist (although I did work in that field years ago) but know that there is such a thing as the right to quiet enjoyment of your property within UK housing law.
#28 - P. Mason replied on the 9/04/2014 5:10:41 PM
The right to quiet enjoyment specifically refers to the right to enjoy a rented property without interference or harassment from a landlord. It has nothing to do with noise or nuisance neighbours. Thought I'd clarify that important distinction.
#29 - Malarki replied on the 9/04/2014 9:46:29 PM
Thanks for the clarification P Mason - as I said before it's been a while since I was involved in housing law. Which once again demonstrates the need to get specialist independent advice - see for example this info from Govan Law Centre: www.govanlc.com/nuisance.htm. The thing is not to rely on what chancers like myself witter on about on forums but go to an independent expert (which the council don't necessarily qualify as) on such things.
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